Episode 49: Create the Perfect Brand Visibility Engine with Samantha Eng

The Fast-Track Woman Podcast: Episode #49
Create the Perfect Brand Visibility Engine with Samantha Eng

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 Meet Podcast Guest, Samantha Eng.

Samantha Eng is a brand visibility expert with over 15 years of experience in brand management, public relations, and social media. Past and current clients include, Ferragamo, Chloe, Michael Kors, Karl Lagerfeld, Calvin Klein, Fendi, Marriott Luxury Collection, Hilton Curio Collection, and more!

Samantha works with brands, companies, entrepreneurs, and solopreneurs in "luxury" markets to amplify their brand message through owned and earned media strategies.

 About this Podcast Episode.

Terra Bohlmann interviews Samantha Eng, brand visibility expert with over 15 years of brand management, PR, and social media strategy for brands that include Ferragamo, Chloe, Michael Kors, Karl Lagerfeld, Calvin Klein, Fendi, Marriott Luxury Collection, and Hilton Curio Collection. Samantha works with brands, companies, and entrepreneurs in "luxury" markets to amplify their brand message through owned and earned media strategies. Samantha shares valuable advice on how women entrepreneurs can create the perfect (and simple) brand engine using PR and social media strategies. Since Terra and Sam are good friends, there is no filter on the advice that women should follow to build a brand that makes you proud.

Ready to fast-track your business success this year? Join Terra in her 12-month mentorship program at TerraBohlmann.com/accelerator

 Resources, Tools, and Links Mentioned in this Episode.

 Read and Download the Transcript for this Episode.

Terra Bohlmann (00:19): Hello. Welcome back to this episode of the fast track entrepreneur. I'm your host Terra Bohlmann and I am so excited today to bring you a brilliant woman who I've not only had the chance to work with, she's been part of my mastermind for I think a year and a few months already. And I've also hired her as well. So I've personally worked with this woman and she is the resilient in the area of copywriting. So let me introduce you to Megan Haney. So Megan Haney is the founder of MeganWords.com. She's a professional conversion copywriter for purpose driven businesses that are created to help other women entrepreneurs that have worthy causes. She helps them communicate their value with the world. She has a bachelor's in communication and worked for over 12 years in diverse corporate communication roles at a multi billion dollar. Yes, billion dollar fortunate top five company as the senior writer for the CEO of a Forbes ranked top 10 best employer in Canada. And Megan is also Canadian and we love our Canadians. So, but where Megan really finds her meaning is in helping women entrepreneurs write words and websites and email sequences specifically that makes them so proud and excited, and it also reflects their voices. And those of their brands hugely supports the value of women that they bring to the entrepreneurial landscape. And she's super passionate about what strong writing and storytelling can do to humanize a business, connect with readers, and inspire action. So please join me in welcoming Megan Haney.

Megan Haney (02:08): That was such a generous introduction. Thank you.

Megan Haney (02:13): That was such a generous introduction. Thank you. No problem. And Megan is a, she lives, you know, the laptop lifestyle, right? Where she's traveled all over the world. But where are you right now? Currently? I am in Colona, British Columbia, a West coast Canada. Nice. Awesome. Yes. So I love always a little bit Santera I know we've, we've actually worked together for closer to two years. Two years. Oh my gosh. Yeah. But I'm still a huge fan of yours. I've listened to every single episode of this podcast. Haven't missed a one. Oh my gosh. I was so excited. I feel like I'm cool. I'm qualified. I like, I know the format, you know the formula. Okay, fabulous. Good. Then you won't be surprised on the last question that I answer or that I ask you. Perfect. All right, so while we're jumping, so one thing you're masterful at, and I've even hired you to do this for me as well, is email sequences.

Terra Bohlmann (03:05): Can you tell us what does email mean to you? What does email mean to me? That's a fascinating question. It is, yeah. You know what, it isn't in comparison to other platforms, Terra, is a direct line to people. I mean, of course we still have one-on-one, but as it pertains to the one to many platforms, email is more personal than some of the other platforms that we have available to us. Very true. Very true. You know, I came from, my first job was I was a computer programmer out of college and you know, and even so, I'm in that gen X realm, right? And I live and breathe through email and it's just, it's one of those things that really my email becomes my work cue tells me what to do. That in my Google calendar being my boss like that you're so right.

Megan Haney (03:54): Like email is that for, it's for me and so many other people in the world. So I think a little while there was some talk that email was going to die out that we were using it wrong. You know, that we should be using messaged. So many of the emails we send should be just used on messenger is should place a phone call. Email is not going to last and I understand the perspective but I don't think that's actually the way it's shaken out at all. Right. It's still so used. Email is so not dead and everyone who was, I feel like kind of talking that way. It was because they were probably developing an app or a chat bot for Facebook messenger or the whole texting thing. Like get me nuts to like get the text. Not the emails, but what do we call them?

Megan Haney (04:39): Like the robotic text, you know, it feels very impersonal where email done. Right. And the way that you do it for your clients, it's like literally they're writing to their best friend. And that is like, there's such magic and power in what you do with that. So let's talk about no problem. So let's talk about an email sequence or you know, like a nurture sequence, which is what a lot of people call it. So what is that for people who are like either new into the online space or like she's just gonna talk to me about writing emails. Like I write a million emails a day. Like you know the difference. Yep. Let me back up. So like the difference between just doing a normal email, like responding to client request or if you're working with someone on your team versus the type of emails that you write for people. Well, how I'd like to answer that is to start with what I would call the definition of copywriting. And how would that differ from other kinds of writing. Copywriting is writing that is designed to get readers to take a specific action. And it uses persuasive techniques to do that and I think sometimes I hesitate to use that explanation because I'm definitely the sort of person that leads with my heart first. And you and I were having a conversation we, before we began this about how gross can sales can feel

Megan Haney (05:58): When not done the right way. But I think that when you're really in tune with how it feels and how it's going to be perceived by other people, marketing is not a dirty word. Copywriting is not a dirty word. It's just about getting people to take a specific action. And it's not necessarily even about sales. I was going to talk about this later, but I'll bring it up now. Conversions is a word that we use a lot in our world and when people think of conversions, they often think about sales specifically, but there are a lot of different actions that we need people to take on the way towards a sale, right? So as it pertains to email, we need them to stop, stop the scroll. We need them to open the email. We want them to read the email and want them to click on something in the email. And all of that happens before you ever sell anything.

Megan Haney (06:40): Totally. And a lot of the times it's, you know, one of the conversions would just be replying and engaging back and forth. Right? It's like, you know, it doesn't have to always be click here and buy add to cart. It's not about that. It's really about getting them to engage and be aware and take them on this journey. And that leads in perfectly to, you know, the whole idea of what you do really well. And I, I know you've, cause you've done it for me and you've also done it for other people in our mastermind as well as your other clients. But one of your things that you're known for is creating a email sequence. Can you walk our listeners through why an email, what it is and why it's important and at what point would they be like, why do I need one of those?

Megan Haney (07:22): Yes. So the awesome thing about an email sequence, it's basically a sequence of emails that are strung together in a strategic order that guide people to, again, towards a specific action. And the awesome part about email sequences is that they're automated, which is the beautiful one and done thing. When people think they don't have time for it, it's actually something that you tee up on the backend and works hard for you while you do other stuff.

Terra Bohlmann (07:48): Yeah, it's a system and I love it. Save time because you have these beautifully well-written emails that will just be working for you in the background.

Megan Haney (08:00): Yes. Beautiful. So they, they differ from email or sorry, but you know, quote unquote regular emails or newsletters in that they are pre-written strategic designed to get people to take a certain action, which you know, your newsletters can do a little bit of that too, but they tend to be, you can be a little more fly by the seat of your pants with your newsletters, engage, be friendly, talk about what you're doing, ask, you know, engage your audience because they signed up because they want to hear from you.

Terra Bohlmann (08:24): Totally. Which I didn't get at all. So people would used to opt in to my email list and because I've been doing this almost a decade now, so I think I'm at like nine years and I would like the difference of build your list, build your list. So I would do that and we'll talk about what a lead magnet is because that's a good starting point of why you would need an email sequence behind it. And my, I had 22 lead magnets on my website, which is insane. I would never recommend that I was awesome at producing content and people would go and download it and then they would get the thing, the guide or the ebook or the checklist or whatever I had on there. So they would get that and then nothing else would happen. It is so common.

Megan Haney (09:05): I got to say, so many of the people I work with have these beautiful freebies and nothing that happens behind them. Yeah. So then you're like, okay, so I've done all this work, but it's like, just take it the next and final step, which is how you get those freebies to make you money down the road. Right. And that's where Megan comes in. In the second part. Everyone's like, do your lead magnet, do your lead magnet. And people will do it and then it just stops. So why, right. There's some valuable and it's awesome to provide your people with value and serve them. Totally. So what is, what's, what is a lead magnet? We'll back up with that because that may be people are like, what? What is she talking about? What's a lead magnet? Well, you know, using the terminology lead magnet is the perfect way to like get your head around understanding your leads, those prospects, the potentials that could work with you.

Megan Haney (09:53): Let's draw them to you as though by magnetic force with a thing that they want. And that thing can take lots of different forms. It could be a guide, it could be a tutorial video, it could be a checklist, it could be really anything you can dream up so long as it's what your dream client feels they need. Yeah, like it's like a challenge, a quiz, something free that is a ethical bribe. I've heard it calm. And to give them something of value just to see what it would be like to work with you and also establish you as an expert in seeing the value. In that moment you're saying, will you please give me your valuable email address in exchange for my valuable freebie? Exactly. So it's win, win and then you get the email list. So I had mine and I was scared to ever email anyone because I didn't want to bother them.

Terra Bohlmann (10:42): So I here I was building this list with no sequence in the back or I wasn't even doing like the weekly newsletters or anything because I didn't want people to unsubscribe and be like, I don't want to bother people in their email. Email is so valuable to me and I'm very protective of what comes in my email. And yeah, so that's the mindset I had. And in reality when someone said to me, okay, so people wanted your free thing, you gave it to them, they asked and gave you permission because they want to hear from you and then you're not emailing, you're not giving them any more value. I was like, that's a way to look at it. It was, I was coming from a place of scarcity instead of like serving people who've raised their hand to say, Terra, I want to hear more stuff from you.

Megan Haney (11:29): Well I know you gotta, you know, pull up your socks and be like, you know what? I'm awesome. I'm the bomb. I'm awesome sauce and I have stuff to share and people do want to hear from me. I know, I hear you. I hear you. So it's like, so in thinking of you've got your lead magnet, which is a great start to then you know, you send them the thing and then this is where Megan's expertise comes in is like, then you have an automated nurture sequence. So she writes it once and then you put it to work. And then in the background using a tool like MailChimp, I use Kartra, there's Infusionsoft, Convertkit. I mean there's a million apps, right? That you know, allow you to manage this from not automated standpoint, but you plug in the emails that she gives you and then you know it's connected on your website and let the magic go.

Terra Bohlmann (12:18): Then it becomes what do you need to do to give away your freebie? And once they get it, then they're going to get Megan's magical emails in the back to get them to do things so they come closer to you and eventually buy your thing. This scenario you just described is what I most often do for my clients is write the emails that follow behind a freebie or a lead magnet. Now, I totally hear you because I've subscribed to things where it's like, you know, you download, you're saying, and it's like, you know, it seemed interesting. I was like, I knew you wanted to see that data research and one of that white paper or whatever. And then it's like immediately like in the same email, it's like we're here, buy my stuff, buy my stuff, buy my stuff, buy my stuff. And I'm like, okay, now like unsubscribing.

Terra Bohlmann (13:01): So it can be done much more delicate. Totally. Yes, yes. To where it's like when I read Megan's emails that she does, she knows her clients so well and not just her clients but who they serve so well that it's like reading something from a friend. Like it's so cool. So it's such a gift. So yeah, just shout out to you on that. So when emails are great, they work right? They're worth it. I guess the real question becomes how do you get people to even read emails? So like walk us through like, you know, they want the freebie so they're going to immediately open that one. Then what's next? Like, how do you get them to open the other emails? You're totally right. It's about getting people to read them. It's not just that, it's also about how do we get them to open them and how do we get people to keep opening them. So I'd like to share if it's alright with you and your listeners, I'd like to share three tips I could suggest on how to make that happen. Totally. All right.

Megan Haney (14:00): Here we go. Here we go. Here we go. So I would start by asking you a question , Terra. Okay. When you look in your own inbox, let's say you've been away from your inbox for a day or even a couple of days and it's full and you do your scan. If I ask you to notice your own behavior when you hop in your own inbox, what are you scanning for when you're looking to see, you know, what needs to be read, what needs to be dealt with? First subject lines. Yeah, who it's from. Yup. That's actually the one I was hoping you'd touch on. Sender is so important and it's the thing that I would say a lot of people aren't talking about. We're talking about subject lines and the content and how to write persuasive content. But if it's not from the right center, you're not going to be inspired to open it in the first place. So if your company officially is called Navigation Forward, I joined your freebie and I know you by your name, Terra. That's how I, you know, I found your freebie, saw your face.

Megan Haney (14:52): Terra, looking forward to my freebie. What is it again? My freebie. Yeah, Destination Success Workbook. And it arrives in my inbox from Navigation Forward. It doesn't inspire me to open like I want, I want to open the emails from my friends. Yeah, no totally. I'm not opening the support@, you know, or the hello@ like, no, give me like a human being name, right? Yeah, totally. You're like, Oh, did she email me? I got an email from so and so. So yeah, I mean if you're a bigger company, you always have the option to experiment with what helps people desire to open the emails. Right. So you know, if you need to have titles, maybe you have Terra@NavigationForward or Annie@...You can expand it. Yeah, totally brilliant. All right, so try with the the sender, I can't remember if we touched on it or not yet, but one of the objections that comes up for people that I work with for my clients is that they don't want to bug people.

Megan Haney (15:49): Right. They don't want to show up in their inbox too often. They don't want to, you know, be annoying. So one I'd like to highlight that if someone opted in to hear from you, it means that they chose to hear from you. So you can let it go from that perspective. But the other thing is there's been some research done, I forget the name of the research firm, but they spoke to about 2000 adults. And of those people, 91% of them, that's high. That's a vast majority. So that they do like to receive promotional emails from the companies they do business with. Interesting. That's like totally changed my mind that it's actually blows my mind. Yeah. I was actually, I was surprised quite how high that was as well. But I mean two thousand two thousand people's not nothing, right? Yeah. So the reason I give that preface is that one they do want to hear from you and people at large are saying they want to hear from them.

Megan Haney (16:33): So how often is often enough. The tool that I would like to share with you here is called the Fibonacci sequence. So yes it sounds very sounds very busy. That's right. So you may have heard of it in school. Potentially the Fibonacci sequence has seen a lot in nature, but what it is is a sequence of numbers that is determined by adding the previous two numbers in the sequence to get the next number. So it starts with zero one and hopefully you can follow us on the podcast. But if you start with zero in one ad, zero in one and you get one. So so far the code is zero one one you add one and one together you get to, so the code now is zero one one two you add the print. The previous two, one plus two is three and you get zero.

Megan Haney (17:24): One one, two, three, two plus three is five. So the next number is five three plus five is eight and so on. I think for some people, this part of the explanation will help others. I might lose. So bear with me. When I tried to explain this concept at your mastermind in Miami, I likened it to a snail shell, which is that spiral. It starts very small in the middle and starts to get bigger and bigger and bigger. That's an illustration of how the Fibonacci sequence appears in nature. Apparently it also appears in sunflowers in pineapples, in pine cones, and kind of does that start super small and gets bigger. So that's what the sequence is. As for how you can apply this to the frequency of your emails, I'd like you to imagine that each of those numbers in the sequence is the day that you are sending your email sequence so that you say that there's eight emails you want to send.

Megan Haney (18:19): So we're going to call the very first call day zero the day that somebody downloads your freebie. Okay. On day one, the first day of the sequence, day one, they get one email later that same day, this freaks people out later, that same day, day one you send another email. So that means you can send two emails on day one. But stick with me, stick with me. Okay. On day two, you send an email. On day three you send an email and then suddenly you give them a little break. On day four, you don't send it, you wait until day five to send another email. And then you give them a little longer break still and wait until day eight. So the reason I suggest this, and it's, and by the way, this is not my technique, this is something that's used in the copywriting world, is that when they download your freebie, when they first heard of you, you're top of mind. And this is when they're hot. This is when you want to be in their inbox and quote unquote in their face because that's when you're most likely to get a sale. So by being super present in the beginning, you know, send them the freebie, get two emails on the first day, another email on the second day, and then start to give them a little space so you don't bug them. Right. It kind of struck that great balance.

Terra Bohlmann (19:25): That's juicy. That's so good. I mean, I don't know anyone who's teaching the thought that you're giving me permission to send two emails in one day and then like be able to show that service upfront, right. Of like you're not asking for a sale. It's like, yeah,

Megan Haney (19:42): I love it. Here's the thing is it's not, I mean there is, there is science, but there is no email police. Like they're not coming for you. You can, you can try things and people can hit the unsubscribe button. But you know what? I give everyone listening permission to not be afraid of that. I mean, you subscribe and unsubscribe on occasion. It's about finding the things that work for you and it's not personal and it's not going to sink your business. Nope.

Terra Bohlmann (20:06): And that, and I went into email marketing with that, with the incorrect mindset around, it was like, Ooh, scarcity. I don't want them to leave so I'm not going to bug them. Which then I'm not, it's not working for me. Like, you know, instead of Hey, cool, like now I see it. Oh they unsubscribed. Like I can send an email and you know, and I sent, I was, I'm doing, I'm doing like an affiliate promotion and I sent three emails to my list and with just because of the promotion, I've lost over a hundred unsubscribes. So people, a hundred people from my list have said peace out, you know? And I'm like, okay, like I could go and I know, I'm sure there are entrepreneurs that will go look at all the people who unsubscribed and then have all this like negative, like, I can't believe my Aunt Mary unsubscribed from, you know, or Oh, you know, that hurts my feelings.

Megan Haney (20:56): Like I just choose not to marry that ever going to buy from you. They're never going to buy. Right. And now I'm just like, I don't really look at it. Or if I do, I'm like cool, like whatever. You know, I'm going to focus on the people who are like, you know, champions behind things, not the ones that I like. Now I'm just not interested in what you have to say. So frankly, that could be the nugget here, Terra, for our listeners, is don't let fear of people unsubscribing take away the value that you could be offering to the people that love you and really want to hear from you. Okay? That needs to be on a quote and you need to share that on. Yes, we need a meme. We need a meme about that. No, that's beautiful. And the fact that hidden, here's the other reality, like I use Kartra.

Megan Haney (21:39): Some people use, you know, Ontraport, whatever, like we pay, it's a monthly fee based on the number of people in your database, right? And it's like, so if you're going to just hoard people and not want them to quote unquote unsubscribe or remove them off your database and clean it up, sometimes you're going to always pay a premium every month for a tool because it's tiered, right? If you have 3000 people or below it's X price from three to 10 it's a higher price and that goes up from there. And it's like it's a good way to constantly be kind of cleansing your list, right? Also helping with your conversion rates, which are really valuable. Hey, if I send this email out, usually 3% do something with it or 5% do something and you can better predict your sales. And it's really cool if frankly it's a whole rabbit hole.

Megan Haney (22:32): We could go down if we want. That's where I get like super geeky and all that stuff. But like it just helps you run your business better. And it took me like five years to learn that fast track and you know, don't be where I was like and not understand that cause it's really valuable to know that. And then I also was trying to do a lot of my own stuff when it was like I need to bring in the dream team of people who know me, know my customers and know like how to do this better than me. Right. And that's hence, that's why I found Megan. So anyway, so we were working on tips on how to make it happen. We got take notice and we talked about frequency and kind of a framework for how often to send emails. Yep. And then before kind of getting to my last tip, I have a question for you Tara.

Megan Haney (23:17): I'm wondering if you saw, I know you did, but I'm going to ask you like, did you watch Love is Blind on Netflix? Did I watch love is blind, you know I did. I'm a freak for reality shows and the Bachelor, the Bachelorette, any of those type of shows. I binge watched General Hospital, the Tiger King like heck yeah, I know what my family was talking about at dinner. I was like, what are you people watching? I know it's next, next level. Love is Blind. Was that for me? And it was one of those that I thought, cause you've met Darin, my husband and when we start Netflix a series together, right now we're doing Versailles. I mean name them and we've, we've watched them. And I thought Love is Blind. This one's going to be mine. Because what happens is he travels for work or whatever and I like don't have something that's just mine. So I was claiming Love is Blind as mine and he doesn't listen to this podcast and hopefully it's like workers are the guys who work with aren't listening either. But he started watching it with me and was like kind of got into it, too. So then it wasn't just mine. I had to wait for him in order to like quote binge watch it. So it was like, Oh Darin, darn you!

Megan Haney (24:35): Like you could watch it your head, not tell him and watch it again. Yeah

Terra Bohlmann (24:39): Know, right. I know. But the the efficiency person in me would be like, I can't like waste the time to watch it again. I know like so bad, but Love is Blind. I wasn't really good. So

Megan Haney (24:50): What was it about waiting for Darin to be able to watch the next episode? That was so torturous?

Terra Bohlmann (24:57): Cause I had to know what happened next. It was like a, I had to know. I just had to know.

Megan Haney (25:03): And how did they achieve that? I want to talk about how they, how they made you want the next episode.

Terra Bohlmann (25:08): But there was cliffhangers. There were, yeah. It was like open loops.

Megan Haney (25:15): Who's he going to pick? Which one? Yes. You don't get to know unless you watch the next episode. So the reason I had this whole preamble about bad shows that we're watching on Netflix is because I wanted to see how we can take those behaviors into email. Like how can we make people feel the same way about Netflix shows that they have to know what happens next and put that in our emails. Cause let's keep people opening. We've talked about getting them to open in the first place. How do we get them to keep opening? That's a technique that I love to use in emails. You can do it with subject lines. Okay. You can have subject lines that make people want to open it because they have a cliffhanger just from reading the subject line and you get them saying, I need to know within this email. But even from within an email, you can answer the cliffhanger that's opened by a subject line. Give them that value but don't be like, and there you go, done deal. You don't, you got the value you came for, it's over. You could try adding a PS that says, but you know, but what about, what about this thing? And they're like, Oh, what about that thing? I don't know. And they'll have to read your, you know, the one trick here, Terra, I think is that you can't string people along. No clickbait but no clickbait.

Terra Bohlmann (26:30): Right? And I love using the subject lines that are peak, the curiosity and then I answer it right away because it drives me nuts. If it's like, here's the cure for whatever, you know, and it's like, and then they don't even go back and answer that. Like that's now that's an unsubscribed for me. So if I do a cliffhanger or a inquisitive, you probably have a better word for it. Email, subject line. It's like I want to answer it right away and get into the next curiosity generating perhaps. Yeah. But I'm not great at leaving the open loop for the next one. I mean, obviously my email sequence probably does that. So download the workbook and we'll be able to see that. But yeah, I'm not, that's something that I'm learning from you too that I need to do. So that's cool. That's awesome. Copy writer Terra, you don't have to do it yourself. Well, for my weeklies, you know, like my weeklies are just kind of, I love stories. Yes, yes. Yeah, yeah, for sure. So, okay, so those are your three things. I want it before we go, I want to make sure you explain what your bridge approaches, which is like your customized framework of it's copywriting genius actually. But as far as before we jump over to the bridge approach, do you have any other insider copywriting tips for email specifically that you can share with people?

Megan Haney (27:51): Oh, I'm glad you asked that one. Terra, I do have something I'd like to share. I think this will be a good tie in to the bridge approach actually because one element of the bridge approach is the dream customer because an important part of copywriting for emails or otherwise is to be super, super clear on who you're talking to. And I know you've talked about this in other episodes and hopefully it's being driven home to everybody that you got to know who you're talking to. I think it's a Marie Forleo-ism. If you're talking to everybody, you're talking to nobody. So

Terra Bohlmann (28:18): Exactly. Not everybody's your customer. Yes. Like don't cast a wide net there. So yes, it's so true. No, no. Your ideal reader, you're one person. You're Jillian. My perfect customer's name is Jillian, which is funny cause now there's, we have a Jillian in our mastermind and Megan is also friends with Jillian. #ShoutOutJilliane So like it's when you go and get that specific with your perfect customer and name him or her, like it comes into your life literally by name. So if we got any Lisa's listening, you know, Lisa hit me up. That's awesome. I love it. Anyway, I didn't mean to distract you. No, no, that's all right. So

Megan Haney (28:56): That was just a preface because that's not the tip. That's something that people are talking about widely. But what I wanted to bring up here is that so you know who your dream client is. How do you talk in a way that vibes with them and my little insider copywriter tip for you here is that you can eavesdrop on how your target market is communicating. So you can go, so think about what matters most to your client. Let's say that your client is trying to lose weight and you have to be a little bit more specific than that. Like what's the situation that's driving her to lose weight? But for example, you could check out Facebook groups that are for women that are trying to lose weight or whatever specific niche she's in and you can look at the language that she's looking to using to describe her problems. So you can find the language that she's using on different social

Megan Haney (29:42): And another place. This one's a bit more of a stretch. You may not have heard before. You could also hop on Amazon and look at the reviews that people are writing of the books that are supposed to solve their problems. That's a really good negatives or positives like the super helped me because, or it didn't meet my needs because, and use those elements in your copywriting. That's really good. One thing, and I liked the Amazon, that's like super spy technique. Another one, two of them that I've recently, well you know I've done surveys, like you can survey people and you ask open ended questions. So you can use a tool like Typeform or survey monkey and ask open ended questions and see how they answer it and be like, thank you. Like you're telling me how to talk to you. And the other tool that I'm psychotic about, but you can only hit it up once a day unless you have the paid version.

Terra Bohlmann (30:32): It's called answerthepublic.com. You know, that way. So it's like you can literally type it in and see what people are searching. We'll put that in the show notes. But, but yeah, so all four of these, I mean there's no shortage of being able to find out what your perfect customer is saying. No. And then, you know what I mean? So at the risk of being overly obvious, if you have a dream client that you're working with, get them on the phone and ask them the question. I mean, if you have that kind of relationship with them, there's no reason that you shouldn't. So there's five ways or we just gave you to be able to get into the mind of your perfect customer and be able to use their words versus you putting it through our brain filters. This is why copywriters are amazing because we tend to put it through our own filters and talk about the solution or even sometimes the benefits as opposed to what they're saying in their head.

Megan Haney (31:23): Right. And that builds, know, like, and trust. When they understand that you understand what the heck they're going through. When they see themselves reflected on the page, she's like, Oh my God, get out of my head. This is so what I need and she's feeling that before she's even finished reading what you've got to say on our percent. That is so juicy. Like this stuff is so good and this is why I love this podcast because we're fascinating. I mean, this is why I'm a writer because I love this stuff, right? I mean, but it's like we're not just talking about like, Oh, this is like some really cool technique. No, we're going deep. Like I don't know any other person that's sharing this kind of level of stuff. Like this is really good. Megan, thank you so much for your transparency on this course.

Megan Haney (32:01): Now that we have that inside tip, which is huge, right? I would love for you to share your bridge approach because this is something you know we've talked about a lot and that's your proprietary method that you take people through, which is why at the end people love working with you. So yes, I'll keep it light, Terra, because if people want to see it more in depth, they can visit my website, Meganwords.com and this is visible there, but the bridge approach is my framework for writing. Phenomenal copy. It's an acronym. Each letter in the word bridge stands for an element of the approach. B is for business. What do you do to generate revenue? R reason, why do you do what

Megan Haney (32:40): You do? I is for intrigue or when the story of your brand began because people love stories. Tariff. That's what humanizes business and can absolutely dream client what we just talked about. Who do you love to work with? Your great differentiator. Some people call this unique value proposition. Some people call it your UVP here. What are the other tops? Your secret sauce, your, sorry. There's other, there's other terminology for it that's called lots of different things, but it's really about where you fit in the market. What makes you special, what makes you the choice compared to the other people that are like you. Love it. And last is expression. How you'll present your brand voice to connect with your audience. When you have the answers to these six questions, you're well poised to write copy that's really gonna resonate with the people that you want to hear it

Terra Bohlmann (33:26): Right. And what's really cool is like if you're like, okay B, I know my business, you know, but I don't really know my how expression. I'm not, you know like when you work with someone like Megan, she takes you through this. So because she needs to understand the B R I, D, G, E so that she can knock it out of the park for you. And so you're not just getting like to me, like I didn't just pay her to write copy. Like instead I got so much clarity through your process that because if I'm stuck on, I don't know what my great differentiator is, she's going to dig and help me find that. So it's like that's really super valuable.

Megan Haney (34:06): Absolutely. When you choose to work with me, it's not just like, here, tell me these things. I need to series of questions in a strategic order designed to get the information out of your head. And if you haven't thought it through before, it's, at times it's asked in different ways to try and get there. But if you have any problems, like the next step is to talk to each other and I'll help you to get out if you're having trouble accessing it.

Terra Bohlmann (34:26): Right. And so there's so much more like this, you know, writing really there is, it's a lot of psychology and a lot of it, if it just makes working with a copywriter easier when you can answer the these questions. But if you work with a really good one, they're not going to just ask you these high level questions and go do their thing. Instead, they're going to be like literally in the head of your perfect customer profile or the person that they're writing to. And you'll get it back and be like, Oh my gosh, this is so good. So good. And then so anyway, so yeah, so the bridge approach. Brilliant. So speaking of story, because now we've opened this loop, we have to close. Why the bridge? Like what's up with britches?

Megan Haney (35:08): Okay, so the bridge, I chose the bridge because I started knowing that I needed my framework to be about connection is copy is the bridge that connects you as the person selling yourself frankly as well as your goods and services with the person that you really want to hear them. And when your copy is not clear and enticing and interesting or you know, even the right path for your customer, it's a disconnect. And it's as if you were on one side

Terra Bohlmann (35:38): Of a Canyon and your dream client is on the other. Those words just like, Ooh, yeah, if you don't have the right means to connect. Perfect. And if you go, so if you want really, if you want to have total website envy and website copy envy, just go to Megan's website, which is called MeganWords.com. So MeganWords.com and immediately when I first even went to her website I was like, I love it. This girl, she's speaking my love language. And if that resonates with you then you know, cause she knows her perfect customer well enough to be like, Oh okay. And if that resonates with you then she's probably the copywriter for you. What was your, I'm also a bit of a branding geek, which is why I got so into the bridge approach and making sure all those different elements of my brand are tied together.

Terra Bohlmann (36:30): I love that stuff. Just say go to her website and you might see some really cool bridges. I mean and travel's kind of her jam. So again, if you want to go to see some really cool bridges and see how she does all the, she tied in her branding with her words and just go to MeganWords.com Oh yeah. You won't just see like a bridge, the framework. You'll also see pictures of me on bridges like around the world. I definitely didn't, you know, travel around the world taking pictures of myself on bridges. That would be weird only. Yeah, that totally happens. Why not? Yeah, exactly. I love it. That's so fun. I got into, I got to stick in here quickly to Terra. I am, we talked about emails today, but I also have like a secret soft spot for websites. I'm a website geek, too.

Megan Haney (37:14): I freaking love them. Totally. Like those are the two main things you do. She'll write in your entire website copy for you and also the email sequence that goes with your lead bang. Like it's a one stop shop. That's brilliant and you don't, it's hard to find people to write your website. It is. I mean it's like, yeah. And so the fact that she totally geeks out about it and loves it, it's like she's a bit of a, what do I want to call that? Like a, what word am I? What a Jill of all trades. I don't know. No, no. The opposite. Like you're like a North star, like something really rare. You know, like, like you're right. You're just very like, it's very rare to find someone that'll write an entire website anymore. Like I'm telling you. And it's not just for people who don't have their websites yet.

Terra Bohlmann (37:57): If that's what people are thinking, it's not just that I do re-brands as well beginning frankly, after you've been in business for a few years and you really, it takes a while to understand as you're doing and who it is you're serving and how you feel to be a business owner and what sounds like you right, you need to eventually redo the site. So that's a great point to say. It's like sometimes when you're just starting out you're going to go have a Squarespace or Wix or whatever and you're just need to get a website out there with whatever, right? You know, words that work for you right now, right. And then as money starts coming in and then you want to kind of take it to the next level and you're ready to scale your business, then it becomes like coming back and doing these like strategic things which is going through the bridge approach and then this and that and then tying it all together and that's what she's talking about from like a re-brand standpoint. And it's like, then it's all next level like cause and you have so much data because you have worked with people, people have transacted with you and it's really, really cool. So yeah, have no website. Shame is not allowed on this podcast instead, you know, use it.

Megan Haney (39:07): Tell a really short story on late at this point. But when I was a little girl, I remember when I discovered adjectives of all things, adjectives, right? So I remember I wanted to share with a relative of mine, this newfound knowledge. And I wrote a story and I remember standing in the living room and the sun was shining through the tall windows in there and it was so warm and the carpet was white. It was so inviting. And I was reading to him and I said, you know the princess with long, wavy, beautiful golden blonde hair wrote in on her white, tall, short haired, brave Steed through the dark, mysterious, creepy forest to meet her handsome, tall love a Prince. And he laughed at me. And of course it is funny, right? Like right now. It's funny cause it's cute as like I was seven or something.

Megan Haney (39:57): Right? And too many adjectives as that seven year old, I was like, excuse me, how dare you laugh at my masterpiece? How dare you like put me in a position where I can't openly share my creativity and explore and be there to receive my exploration, if not my genius, at least my preparation. Absolutely. So that's what I noticed that people are a bit hesitant or shy to share their writing or talk to writing, talk about writing with me because I am a professional writer. Right? I just want everybody to understand that like this is with me. There's a space of no judgment. My only purpose is to help you make your writing be what you want it to be.

Megan Haney (40:42): I love it. That's so beautiful. I mean it's just, and I get it and like, you know, I was so one then we'll totally, I want to make sure people understand how they can connect with you. And I'm going to ask you my funny question, which I'm sure you already know because you've listened to the other podcast, but the one that I noticed and when talk about adjectives, it's like it's a shout out to a Canadian company too. So Lush. Are you familiar with the brand of Lush? I love Lush and smell them before you see them. I love lush and like I had a girl that was on my team, now she's a manager for lush and so I always love to be able to go to them, the mall and I'd be like, I'd go stalk her out and whatnot. And it gives me a reason to go in and there's everything that's so amazing about Lush.

Terra Bohlmann (41:25): It's a kind of a, how would you describe like a bath type of company that you can buy all this amazing stuff that just smells good from perfume to soaps to everything. And so I'm like obsessed with, it's called Rose Jam is the smell that I love and, and I've never, you know, it's in the shower. I have the biggest container of it. And then I have the Rose Jam spray and like I just am walking around in Rose Jam. But for the first time and I read the description of Rose Jam and it was so brilliant. And so now I'm obsessed with anything Lush. Like the way they describe the smell is so on point and so amazing that I'm like an often funny too. They're just like this luscious like I wish I could go grab my Rose Jam. You can put it in the show notes.

Megan Haney (42:18): I totally will. It was just like I am never going to not use Rose Jam because the way they describe the perfect smell and you're like, yeah, okay this is so, there is such power in words and I got to tell you a thing. Seems like toe jam to me. Oh yeah, you don't love it. Yeah. Jam. Okay, well now I may not ever see it. The same smell. No, no, no. Like it's more, I smell it like it's like jelly. So it's like the jam and the raspberry with mixed with a little, it's like decadent as one of their words. Decadent Rose pedals on a flowery field and Oh my God, it's so amazing. So anyway, so yeah, that's the Rose Jam, Not toe jam. But anyway. Okay, so let's transition here. So how can people get in touch with you? Do you have anything for you that you can offer people listening?

Megan Haney (43:12): I know that you're spoiled for choice when you have a copywriter and so I designed my freebie Terra, knowing that people are not just spoiled for choice when it comes to copywriters, but freaking overwhelmed, particularly if you've never hired one before. There's a lot to think about. So I designed my freebie to be how, Oh God, I forget what my own freebies called. It's called the ultimate guide to choosing the right copywriter or the ultimate guide to picking the right copywriter for you. I kind of forget, but I promise the content is better than my recollection of what the title actually is. So you can get that at Megan, Meganwords.com/freeguide where you guide and we will put that in the show notes. So Megan, words.com/freeguide. And I've seen it, I've downloaded it. And it does walk you through the thought process of what you need to know to in order to hire the right copywriter.

Megan Haney (44:09): And what I love about it is it's like the way she lays it out as like, it may be Megan, but it may not be, but she's giving you value so you make the right choice for you. I'm not married to people choosing material, I just want it to be easier. Yep. Because that's a big thing that as an entrepreneur, like we want to make sure we're hiring the right people who get us. And yeah. And I've spent a lot of money on copywriters and some really get it and some totally don't. So that's what I love about the freebie is, is you're just putting it out there for people and walking them through what they need to know to make the right choice for them. So no brainer, MeganWords.com/freeguide. All right. So before we wrap up, I got to ask you my big question.

Megan Haney (44:53): Do they have lifetime channel up in Canada? Right? Probably. I'm not a big TV watcher. I mean I meet more and more. It's like embarrassing. Like I'm aging myself cause I'm like, I love the hallmark channel, you know, and lifetime. But we'll just say maybe it's a Netflix series. I'm not so far behind you. It could be an American thing. No, it's okay. We're going to use Netflix and I might use it going forward. We're going to do the whole Netflix thing. So Netflix is going to produce a bio pic about your life. What actress plays you, so it's not really cheating. I know that you asked this question everybody, so I did put in some forethought, but even if I hadn't, I know what my answer would be. It would be Sarah Jessica Parker probably largely from a looks perspective. I called my best friend to be like, do you think this is a good answer?

Megan Haney (45:38): She's like, I don't know. You always used to point out that she was voted the world's ugliest woman for looking like a horse. I was like, I think you're really like, she's pretty, I'm never here to bash a woman, but like look like a horse. That's completely, exactly. But like you're really pretty too, like and anyway. Okay, so Sarah, Jessica Parker. But I can see it because you're both blonde, you're bubbly and just, yeah. Well my best friend also pointed out that if from a sex in the city perspective, she was a writer. Oh my gosh. That is the huge, that's the biggest part that perhaps like I totally forget, I get more like, Oh yeah, she was all about the Manolo shoes. She was a writer and a really good one because I couldn't help but ask myself, how would Terra's listeners interpret this podcast?

Megan Haney (46:25): Oh my gosh. See that's good. Yeah, no brainer. Sarah Jessica Parker, so she can you know, she can be the actress on your upcoming Netflix biotech. I think you're beautiful. Sarah Jessica Parker. You can also hit the cap as well as Lisa. I love it. Great way to bring it home, Megan words. All right, so thank you so much for being here and, and as always sharing and like not holding back anything. There's no, you know, she just puts it out there and I know you are in this, just like we have this in common, we are all about serving women entrepreneurs that have a bigger purpose, which is how we resonate together. And you totally showed up for that today. I'm so grateful to you for giving me an opportunity to do it, Terra, so thank you. No problem. Well, you have a good one and we'll talk soon. Yeah, you too.

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